Alright, gang! I like the idea of new formats coming into the system. But we've got a problem. WILDCARD is currently a chiptune format. It gives chippist points. ALLGEAR is a mixist format. Now, I'm thinking I should create a format known as 'chiptune' to free up 'wildcard' for new formats in OHBs. First, I will have to reassign all wildcard entries to this chiptune format. WILDCARD would give playa points.

Now, let's not abuse this when it comes around, eh? An OHB using the wildcard format should be worth creating a new format. If it's not everyone involved shall be punished!! D:<

Also, BotBrs should feel free to add format ideas in this thread.

So basically, the 'chiptune' category will be for all types of chip music that doesn't fall under one of the other categories (whether it be a chip not listed, or a combination of chips, or a 'faking it' chiptune)?

And allgear is for making a song which could be non-chiptune with no restrictions on samples/tools?

Wildcard will be for submitting any type of file?

Cool. Also, I plan to submit sega genesis VGMs, KSSs, and HESs in future battles.

for music it seems we have almost everything covered that i can think of. the only things that came to mind were the DS ans PSP. i dont think you can get at the source files for stuff like the DS-10, but i still think it would be a nice inclusion.

with the psp however, it is very easy to get a hold of teh source files. the psp also has a nice variety of tools on it. pspseq is especially interesting http://dspmusic.org/psp/

another good thing about including the psp format is that so few people are making music with it. a few ohcs and botb would be the king of psp music ;D

on a side note, there was an adlib ohc a while back and we all had a lot of trouble getting around to hearing eachothers tracks for votings. it would be pretty cool if somebody made a standalone adlib module player. botb could have its own n00btools, by noobs for n00bz

Tadpole - .VGM and .HES I know of, but what is .KSS?

Allgear may still have restrictions according to a Battle's host.

Chip Champion - help me out a little -- is there a certain fileformat for PSPseq or is .MP3 the easiest thing to submit?

The PSP thing reminds me that we once had a LGPT battle and I don't think there is a format for that either yet.

KSS is master system i think...

I like this idea of one format for chips, one for general music, and one for absolutely anything... it's cool

@puke7 yes PSPseq has pretty small .seq files. the only problem is that .seq files are version specific and wont work between different versions. also, you would need to submit any extra samples you used outside of the basic pack you get with the prog. this could possibly mean having "synth only" and "pspseq unlimited" formats.

the other big prog for the psp is Rhythm which is more of a sample sequencer. it looks pretty, but i havent really used it so i dont know much about it.

When submitting stuff from LGPT, it's just a folder that contains your patternlist and the samples. We just zipped our folders when we submitted our entries then.

PSP? PlayStation Portable?

jaajaj soiled

Wouldn't the quality be higher than what BotB looks for?

On a side note, I think "html/css" should be renamed to "(x)html". The icon can be teh same, dough.

BotB likes quality! :P

so PSPseq would require a version number attached to the format token....

KSS = for the MSX home computer.

kss can even do arcade stuff (z80 variants) and a whole plethora of other many consoles :s

Pxtone?! synth+sample based. japan powered.

Last I checked there were about 1,3gb of freely downloadable and viewable (module format like) files on the pxtone archive (which seems to have vanished) for people to check+listen. Winamp plugin available + playback from within the "tracker". It's quite strange
and different from vertical OR horizontal style of music tools XD

If you guys like quality, then Kulor wouldn't be blabbing on how much you guys hate good music since "See You Next Year" placed horribly Winterchip IV!

Beautiful tribute... bad n00bz.

Klystrack =)

Seconding ant1's suggestion. It's like a Windows version of AHX [that for some reason doesn't spit out .ahx files damnit].

semi-related - with ze ascii OHBs, perhaps BotB could just load the whole contents of the txt file between shitty UBB quote tags so zat no-one has to download zem?

no there is not a finished tracker there is a MML compiler and a thing where you write raw data into a rom with a hex editor and there is a thing which converts .mod which not finished and a tracker which is a long way from finished

Since nobody spelled it out, please correct me if I'm wrong. The diference between Wildcard and Allgear is that Allgear is a SAMPLE PLAYING format, Wildcard was meant for chiptunes that don't match an existing format class.

I think Chiptune should be a format fo chip battles with no format categories, Wilcard should only be possible in big cateorized chiptune compos like Winter Chip.

$0.02

We need a Schizo format for "make any file" collabs. :>

I think we have pretty much saturated all formats,
everything that gets added now on will just be confusing. :P

I agree with Soiled's idea, if wildcard and allgear have already taken meanings, something for just anything else would be nice.

Thanks null :D

Also, could we add a Flash format where we can submit either FLA, ZIP (all the source files), or SWF? We have at least three people who have Flash here: kulor, null1024 and myself.

i suggest not trashie formats, for that use WILDCARD or ALLGEARS... cuz been hones some of the formats had never been used. But well, it's nice to add formats if you guys will use it.

What happened to html?

I think it got overwritten somehow. It's back now.

No hotlinking!! :P

Warning: huge post.

OK, I second^H^H^H^H^H^H^H *THIRD* Soiled's suggestion of Schizo, but I suggest it be trialled out a few times.

I'm keen on shifting wildcard to "chiptune", although I would suggest WILDCARD -> "Wild Chiptune" and ALLGEAR -> "Wild Samplist".

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This could do with a make a game 1 hour compo BUT NO GAME MAKER (runs like utter crap on not-Windows) - if you want a not-cross-platform system, I can suggest Unity, but I would highly recommend only truly cross-platform, open-source stuff - open-source in the sense of "you have the source code and are allowed to compile it anywhere, permitting modification", not the strict OSI definition - or stuff for DOS (as DOSBox tends to emulate stuff well), or, at the very most, stuff which tends to emulate well (I would avoid Windows-and/or-Mac-and/or-Linux-only at all costs).

This would mean Flash would likely be unavailable. Sorry, but you actually need to install Linux ALONGSIDE FreeBSD to get it to work well, or run Firefox in Wine for it to run close to arse.

For this, my suggestions:
- MegaZeux is FANTASTIC for this stuff. There's something called a Blitzkreigzeux (BKZX) which is exactly this, although it allows for outside module music and sound effects.
- Syniphas would agree that a Doom WAD would be a great idea - I would suggest that it be tested for PrBoom, as ZDoom/Skulltag tend to allow for some leeway which PrBoom just ignores and vanilla Doom implodes on, but you can use any editor. I think it should be limited to Boom features - sorry, but Doom Legacy / ReMooD are a bit crashy (FraggleScript), Skulltag is closed source and ZDoom is a pain in the arse to compile on FreeBSD (ACS). Wow, that was extensive.
--- If you want a level editor for Doom, I suggest a DEU-esque one. For a unixy system, I would suggest YADEX.
- Xye is quite a fun game, it's based on Kye (which emulates well under Wine, and there are various open-source ports - Python Kye is apparently quite accurate).
- Cube is a first-person shooter which allows editing of levels ingame (in fact, that is how you edit them). I suggest we just go with stock Cube 1, not Cube 2 (*WAY* too big) nor AssaultCube (compiled it on FreeBSD but it's EPIC FAIL).
- Klotski? There's plenty of clones of it, we'd just need to decide on a standard.
- Anything else I haven't covered? Just not Nexuiz or Quake as the tool you use is a complete and utter pain in the arse to compile or something like that (unless one could suggest a better tool...?).

Some not-open-source-but-in-DOS-and-emulates-well suggestions:
- ZZT is the inspiration for MegaZeux and is really quite fun to mess with quirks in the engine.

Stuff that's kinda impossible to get anything done but I'd be happy with:
- Ruby, Python, Perl. These are kinda fast to hack stuff together with, though, so they're only *just* in this list.
- HTML with some other niceties such as JavaScript and HTML5 features.
- Java, although I've heard complaints about this.
- Assembler. Oh boy. Just note that some platforms (e.g. Amiga) require copyrighted ROMs which you have to pay for, and would be a good idea to avoid.

Stuff I'm not keen on:
- Game Maker. I have also explained this. Sorry for eliminating two otherwise-brilliant choices. There's the ClickTeam stuff if you really want not-cross-platform - from my experience that emulates better under Wine.
- Minecraft, due to its use of LWJGL and jInput, which I haven't compiled successfully for FreeBSD yet.
- Flash. I have explained this.
- Goldsrc / Source stuff - I don't believe these are free, nor cross-platform.
- C or C++. Lovely, but most Windows users probably won't have a compiler, let alone most Mac users (of which there is essentially only one and it's on a 1.9GB DVD). If you can cross-compile then it should be fine, I would suggest this be uploaded after submission.
- D. UGH THIS IS A PAIN TO COMPILE STUFF WITH ON FREEBSD.
- Microsoft Visual C++. Use a different compiler, please - that's the source of really bad C++ files which don't compile on g++. I can suggest MinGW32, Digital Mars, Cygwin, or maybe Open Watcom.
- FORGOT TO MENTION: Anyone who uses C# with XNA should have their computer taken from them and thrown off a huge cliff. I had a LOT of grief encountering these at Ludumdare #18. Aside from Windows, these don't even RUN. C# with Tao should be fine.

Wow at game making post comments. O_O

As for ALLGEAR / WILDCARD, I know the confusion is ...confusing.

WILDCARD could be "OmniChip" and ALLGEAR could be "WildWave".

Sound OK?

at this point changing the names or formats of wildcard and allgear would just be more confusing

First, I agree with Chip Champion. I say we make the icons more relevant. I was thinking that WILDCARD could be like our size-limited module icons except instead of showing the file size it could show an asterisk. What to use for allgear I don't know.

Secondly, I think the game thing will go nowhere. Sure, I'm all for making games and applications for an OHC, but please. In a world like BotB everyone's using something different for an OS. To limit what tools we can use just to help out with cross-platform compatibility is just ludicrous.

really chuffed to see AY-3-8910 in the list !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

@soiled: allgear icon should be an accordion ;D

That would be great!