Since Doom mapping has recently been proven to be quite popular in OHBs (at least amongst some people, ahem), I'd like to suggest rounding out the classic Doom trilogy with the ZDoom format!

ZDoom is a popular source port that introduces many new features to the Doom engine, including but certainly not limited to:
- Room-over-room support, allowing 3D floors, bridges, etc.
- Slopes and portals
- Particles, translucency, coloured lighting and other visual effects
- Scripting of new content, with either DECORATE

or ZScript

- Implements Heretic, Hexen and Strife's editing features
- Support for Boom and MBF extensions
- Better support for multiplayer

Because of all the extra features, ZDoom maps have the potential to be very different from vanilla and Boom-compatible maps. It would definitely warrant a distinct format, especially if Doom and Boom are considered different formats.

ZDoom itself has been discontinued since 2017, but GZDoom and Zandronum are two forks which maintain compatibility with the ZDoom format, while adding their own features. Generally, GZDoom favours single-player WADs and Zandronum has features mostly aimed at multiplayer.

There's some discussion to be had regarding the scope of the format - should we include GZDoom and Zandronum? Should we allow entries that require Heretic/Hexen/Strife IWADs?

In my opinion, we should allow any of ZDoom/GZDoom/Zandronum-formatted maps - as ZDoom is discontinued, it is reasonable for people to want to use an up-to-date source port instead. Entries should therefore specify what source port is required (similar to how specifying the IWAD for Doom/Boom entries).

I also think we should disallow Heretic/Hexen/Strife IWADs - these would potentially require users to buy new games just to play the entries. Limiting the format to Doom II seems reasonable here, as anyone that could play Doom/Boom entries can also play ZDoom entries.

Let me know what you think. Personally I'd love to see more Doom mapping, it's great fun!

Pssst... it's also been a while since the last Doom major, maybe it's time for another...?

EDIT: Made a quick ZDoom badge + medals

, based on its logo

.

this is the only thing that could make doom compos on this site make sense, imo. i've done all my modern doom-related work in gzdoom (with doom II iwad), it is straight up the standard.

i also wholeheartedly support a doom major, because i'd finish my total conversion and win it MWAHAHA.

have really enjoyed the map compos we've done, it's such a natural compo format, and one can't help but fantasize about it catching on a bit more! cuz right now it's just us 5 or 6 weirdos

Should probably be called "UDMF" because that's the map format that ZDoom uses, and if we're expanding it to compatible engines (ex. Helion, which just came out recently) then I think that makes sense.

I'm always a little irrationally angry at ZDoom because I'm kind of a Doom purist and using GZDoom trips up newcomers trying to make (or play) vanilla-compatible or Boom stuff. And I really like dealing with the limitations imposed by those formats, and wish more people would embrace them too!

But Zdoom would be a cool format. And nothing would stop you from submitting a vanilla or Boom-compat WAD to a ZDoom compo.

I too am team purist, I've been playing the WADs on here on Chocolate Doom and PrBoom+/Boom on DOSBox, lol

But I'll respect ZDoom as a format if it happens :)

not on team purist but i think all the points here make sense. it'd be basically nsf+ to doom and boom's nsfc and nsf, so hell yea let's see it happen.

also calling it: kleeder is gonna go for a badge run for this if it becomes real

i don't exactly have a horse in this race at all, but this seems like a sound proposal to me. granted, the dooms are not exactly popular formats as-is - but someone could always take up the mantle after kleeder's all badged up. i'd love to see it even if i won't partake most likely.

i'm gonna go for a badge run for this if it becomes real

im specially curious about custom textures (i still didnt try to use them on doom/boom entries)

Custom textures are easier in UDMF. You just put a PNG in the WAD between TX_START and TX_END lumps. Would be a lot faster for XHB's than adding it to TEXTURE2 and PNAMES and stuff.

been thinking about it, if we get zdoom format does that mean we could have battles for mods such ss brutal doom for example? that wld be really cool.

i'm of two opinions, both of them would like this format but one agrees with the gzdoom/zandronum bit, the other does not. i am of two school's (i am very educated !)

School #1: Allow GZDoom and Zandronum
- It would be no different than getting new toolage for old systems that allows taking advantage of features not previously explored (Like CSM mode on Sega Genesis, or the CH3 mode before Deflemask introduced it)

School #2: Only allow ZDoom and disallow any other sourceports
- GZDoom and Zandronum additions may feel like adding a VRC6 to the NES, i.e. actively expanding a technical boundry by throwing more processing power/space at it. An example would probably be, if I remember right, 3D floors and slopes being a thing in GZDoom but not in ZDoom (i might be wrong, i haven't been into doom for a very hot minute)

If we want to name it ZDoom i think it's fair to follow school 2, but if the intent is to provide a space for modern mapping i think it would be fairer to follow school 1 and name the format something else (GZDoom, perhaps? or UDMF as suggested earlier with the bitpack or description providing the mapping environment and source port required ala idgames)

Hey, what's this Doom thing everyone's talking about?



Goofs aside, it'd be best to target GZDoom; the fact that "ZDoom" has ceased development and GZDoom is a "fork" is really just a formality. The Doom community has long since moved on from trying to target old-ZDoom, and modern editing tools (i.e. Ultimate Doom Builder) are developed with the latest GZDoom version in mind. Trying to stick to the last version of old-ZDoom (2.8.1) will just result in people running into walls when trying to make something cool, since some random feature will be missing (the lack of ZScript and hardware rendering in particular are huge killers).

That said, Hell Yeah GZDoom Format. Though y'all had better celebrate its release with a Major so I can make some Certified Weird Shit(tm). :P

I'd definitely prefer "gzdoom"than "udmf" as the format name, mainly because a layman has probably heard of GZDoom, or at least knows what Doom is. Whereas you only know what UDMF is if you're a turbonerd

ultra deflemask file

I dunno, I like accurate names. And besides, we're all various degrees of turbonerd here.

"GZDoom-compatible" as a compromise maybe?