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Lint_Huffer
Level 19 Mixist
 
Pure Data [vanilla audio]
9th/9

 
coziness 
416th Σ3.198

 
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432nd Σ2.906

 
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426th Σ3.278

 
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416th Σ3.521

 
Manic Elf Blues
 
  428th/441   Σ16.143   Dec 11th 2023 8:44pm
 
 
This is an embarrassingly-simple module which jams around in an F# major blues scale (with an added D-natural for flavor - seriously, that note *has* to be in the F# major blues, the scale is so bland without it). Click the bang button to make it start. Close the program to make it stop. I designed it in purr-data. It uses stock vanilla PD modules.

It was going to be a bit more elaborate, with a more seasonal scale and alternating keys, but then I made the mistake of testing it in vanilla-pd and it wouldn't load and after literally one hour of silently bellowing while deleting modules and screwing around, it started loading - the exact same file that one hour ago wouldn't load. I don't even know anymore. It's genuinely all I can do to not name this "puredata is stu.pd". I think I deserve some credit for that amount of maturity, right? At least a "2" amidst all the "1"s, right? Ho ho ho?

So, I typed up a 5kb rant about Puredata and then deleted it because this is the holidays and we're supposed to be all about fun, food, family, and feelgoods. I know I should have a nice, pleasant, silly little description about how this module is, like, Santa's badass blues elf who just jams relentlessly on the piano like the workshop was a Nordstrom. I genuinely was thinking about it as I naively began what would turn out to be a four-hour exercise in terror and frustration. But I can't. I just can't. I spent four hours on this and the majority of it was spent mentally ranting about every frustrating aspect of Puredata.

In lieu of the full rant, here's my more-civilized takeaway from the experience: I think Puredata is in a really uncomfortable position where it's not quite a grizzled-old-computer-music-beardo's badass showboat tool (Bytebeat, TIC) and not quite a friendly low-stress intro to programming concepts (Klik n' Play) or modular synthesis (bespoke, vcv_rack, sunvox). It has a really gross UI that is uncomfortable with the mouse and yet insists on making you use it (best exemplified by how "[enter]" doesn't commit a new module, but rather just starts a new line, with the only way to commit the module being to click off it). It's unintuitive and frustrating in a sneaky way - when something like Knaecketraecker is unintuitive and frustrating, that's because it's a grizzled-old-computer-music-beardo's badass hobbyist tool, and as frustrating as it is, it's fundamentally fair. Eat Triple Baconator, get fat. Puredata lures you in with a GUI and (in the case of purr-data) cutesy cat icons, but then it leaves you listening to an increasingly-psychotic sample-and-hold blur for ten minutes because there's no obvious way to stop a program that's already running besides just disconnecting the "dac" module. That's like a flavorless salad that somehow has 6,000 calories and ten pounds of saturated fat.

Anyway, in all seriousness, I'm sorry this is crummy, please forgive me.
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180812
Level 31 Chipist
damifortune
 
 
 
post #180812 :: 2023.12.12 6:07am
  
  mirageofher, kilowatt64, cabbage drop, argarak and Lint_Huffer liēkd this
lolll i appreciated the writeup here. this kind of thing still bounces off of me too, though i wonder if i could get more used to it. it's really not how i like to think about making music!

if i may contribute briefly a thought to this rant, let's take a simple effect, vibrato:

trackers - type a few letters and numbers like "HA4" and there is vibrato. easy, 10/10
piano rolls - make an automation clip, draw/generate pitch event data, midi cc1. not the best, but certainly serviceable, 7/10
puredata - you are generating the system that makes the vibrato as well as figuring out how and when to trigger it where you want it to sound. it is powerful, but at what cost, 2/10
 
 
180828
Level 28 Mixist
argarak
 
 
 
post #180828 :: 2023.12.12 10:18am
  
  cabbage drop liēkd this
yeah i can sympathise dealing with some of the frustrations and shortcomings of pure data x.x
it is powerful but very quirky and unintuitive, the way it's designed means that certain conventional things like sequencing can get pretty tedious to make work
i know too well the pain of figuring something out while having an annoying tone blaring in the background. you can turn dsp on or off in the main message screen which is sometimes helpful. i really quite like plugdata as it has a volume control built into it which helps not destroy your ears as much..
 
 
180832
Level 19 Mixist
Lint_Huffer
 
 
 
post #180832 :: 2023.12.12 11:36am :: edit 2023.12.12 11:36am
  
  cabbage drop and damifortune liēkd this
@Dami I get 100% where you're coming from. I'm pretty comfortable with modular, and I don't even necessarily mind having to type out a mathematical function to generate a sine curve to assign to frequency because I can at least appreciate the theoretical power of doing it that way, but Pure/purrdata's UI complicates things every step of the way.

Connecting objects is very finicky, the hitbox for where you're supposed to click doesn't *quite* line up with the tiny hyphen that serves as the graphical representation of where to click, so far too often you either click air or click into the object itself. Considering a huge chunk of the puredata experience is connecting modules to other modules, that's a pretty glaring flaw in my book! This is like if a tracker effects column was always on step 1, so "HA4" was actually "H up-arrow right-arrow A up-arrow right-arrow 4", and the cursor was nearly the same color as the background, and sometimes you didn't actually have to right-arrow over to the next box. It's not unsurmountable, but at the same time, it's more irritating than it has to be, and maybe that's the tagline for my experience with Puredata.

On the other hand, purrdata does allow you to zoom in and out, so maybe it's slightly less-irritating on modern systems than Reaktor... eh heh heh heh...

@agarak Unfortunately, plugdata just plumb refused to work for me - standalone or VST or CLAP, all roads led to the same gloomy Rome. Who knows, maybe once I get it running it'll alleviate all my UI issues and I'll have to eat some crow :)
 
 
182285
Level 29 Chipist
funute
 
 
 
post #182285 :: 2024.01.04 7:22pm
  
  mirageofher and damifortune liēkd this
After reading the rant and comments and thinking about it, using Pure Data reminds me of those hobbyist circuit design projects in a way: you get a bunch of low level bits and pieces (sometimes a whole module if you wanna get fancy), now go string together a bunch of them to build something nifty out of it. It strikes me more as a learning tool for learning audio/DSP things than something to build an actual piece out of.
 
 

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